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New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal" (Read 7442 times)
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #30 - 03/20/18 at 11:03:09
 
::::::::::popcorn intensifies:::::::::
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #31 - 03/22/18 at 06:56:26
 
Hey look Magnum, more of what destroyed this forum in the first place haha.

In all seriousness, I'm on the anti Jaffe side. Drawn to Death was such a turd for the years he spent in it.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #32 - 03/26/18 at 19:23:56
 
Yea well. Opinions may vary for this shit as always. Hasn't changed much after 6 years and probably won't.

This franchise was very close to our hearts, and what this site did back in it's original form was incredible really.

TBH ya'll can argue all you want. Until a new TM is made and it's actually good, your just spitting at each other.

We do have a Dead Horse post on Brawl BTW. It's always lonely in there..........
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #33 - 03/27/18 at 13:04:10
 
MoshfieldAsylum wrote on 03/18/18 at 19:48:13:
I don't think Scott Campbell would want to work with him either considering what went down between them with EatSleepPlay, but I wouldn't mind Scott C.'s involvement (as long as he finally realizes sniper rifles in TM is a stupid idea, heh).


Wait, what happened between Campbell and Jaffe?  As far as I know, they are both friends and would have no problem working with eachother.  Jaffe even talked about Campbell on one of his video logs.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #34 - 03/27/18 at 21:14:15
 
Look it up in Wikipedia or Google or something.

I'm sure it's in there. 
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #35 - 03/28/18 at 07:25:03
 
Vlygar wrote on 03/27/18 at 13:04:10:
Wait, what happened between Campbell and Jaffe?  As far as I know, they are both friends and would have no problem working with eachother.  Jaffe even talked about Campbell on one of his video logs.



https://www.gamespot.com/articles/jaffe-leaving-eat-sleep-play-studio-shifting-t...

Take a look at the article that came out in 2012 when Jaffe left ESP.
Keep in mind EatSleepPlay was founded by both Jaffe and Campbell. Instead of Jaffe staying with EatSleepPlay he left because
1- He did not want to travel to Salt Lake City to work on the game, and wanted to start a new local studio in San Diego.
2 - He did not want to work on mobile games like Scott Campbell wanted to. Jaffe makes the dick-ish remark "I have zero plans to make games like Farmville and Angry Birds." EatSleepPlay's eventual mobile game Cars Vs. Bosses was Twisted Metal-ish though.

Those 2 reasons are pretty selfish and I don't doubt Scott Campbell was pissed. What's Scott supposed to do, bring Salt Lake City to San Diego for the convenience of one guy over everyone else? And Jaffe may not be into mobile games, but to ditch the studio he co-founded and leave it all on Scott C.'s lap wasn't right. On top of that, Jaffe said he'd stick around and help EatSleepPlay perfect TMX - which never really happened. The patches were ineffective for the most part and didn't stop TMX's bleeding. Then he goes on to make Drawn to Death  - spends about 4 years on that game only for it to be DOA on launch. How is it he spent as long on Drawn to Death as he did on TMX when he didn't have to travel 300 miles? Meanwhile EatSleepPlay goes out of business - with Jaffe's San Diego studio eventually going out of business too. If I'm Scott Campbell I'm thinking it was a mistake to deal with Jaffe to begin with. why would he want to put himself through that again? as for Jaffe's point-of-view, I wouldn't know - I don't think he has anything against Scott - but It's very unlikely Scott would work with David again. That may be speculation based on facts, but it's not like they would ever publicly feud because that would be unprofessional.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #36 - 03/28/18 at 09:58:35
 
MoshfieldAsylum wrote on 03/28/18 at 07:25:03:


https://www.gamespot.com/articles/jaffe-leaving-eat-sleep-play-studio-shifting-t...

Take a look at the article that came out in 2012 when Jaffe left ESP.
Keep in mind EatSleepPlay was founded by both Jaffe and Campbell. Instead of Jaffe staying with EatSleepPlay he left because
1- He did not want to travel to Salt Lake City to work on the game, and wanted to start a new local studio in San Diego.
2 - He did not want to work on mobile games like Scott Campbell wanted to. Jaffe makes the dick-ish remark "I have zero plans to make games like Farmville and Angry Birds." EatSleepPlay's eventual mobile game Cars Vs. Bosses was Twisted Metal-ish though.

Those 2 reasons are pretty selfish and I don't doubt Scott Campbell was pissed. What's Scott supposed to do, bring Salt Lake City to San Diego for the convenience of one guy over everyone else? And Jaffe may not be into mobile games, but to ditch the studio he co-founded and leave it all on Scott C.'s lap wasn't right. On top of that, Jaffe said he'd stick around and help EatSleepPlay perfect TMX - which never really happened. The patches were ineffective for the most part and didn't stop TMX's bleeding. Then he goes on to make Drawn to Death  - spends about 4 years on that game only for it to be DOA on launch. How is it he spent as long on Drawn to Death as he did on TMX when he didn't have to travel 300 miles? Meanwhile EatSleepPlay goes out of business - with Jaffe's San Diego studio eventually going out of business too. If I'm Scott Campbell I'm thinking it was a mistake to deal with Jaffe to begin with. why would he want to put himself through that again? as for Jaffe's point-of-view, I wouldn't know - I don't think he has anything against Scott - but It's very unlikely Scott would work with David again. That may be speculation based on facts, but it's not like they would ever publicly feud because that would be unprofessional.



There are some other reasons too that make it seem like there was a bit of a break up.

I don't have time to go dig through all the sources.  They're out there, and I read them, if you want to find them some digging will pull them out. Here's the big things that I saw:

1. Jaffe made several crass and crude remarks, particularly referencing women, during the development of Twisted Metal 2012 that offended quite a number of people both inside and out of the video game world. At first he was pretty firm that he did nothing wrong and refused to apologize, even doubling down on it at times.

Then from out of nowhere he apologized.  Why?  In his twitter, he explained that he found out his comments had offended members of his own company.  No doubt Scott, as co founder, played a role in trying to address what sounds like for all intents and purposes low team member morale within ESP. In Jaffe's words, once he offended members of his own staff he couldn't argue anymore that he hadn't crossed a line.

2. Shortly after leaving ESP Jaffe strongly hinted that him and ESP had had a number of arguments over how nasty the new Twisted Metal could be.  He further went on to indicate this had always been the case with his career, pointing out that with TMB he was constnatly censored (the baptism scene in Preacher's story being one of the most obvious), that with Twisted Metal: Small Brawl he had wanted a much more "adult" game (WTF?! . . . I Mean seriously, WTF?!), that he wanted "Heartland" (cancelled) to be really nasty and Incog resisted, that he wanted "Calling All Cars" to be much more "adult" (with references to more sexual material . . . again WTF . . .), and that with the new Twisted Metal (which keep in mind started out with a goal of teen) the fight had again surfaced.

He was excited to head out on his own, have complete control, and make the game he had always wanted to make.

The result?  Drawn to Death . . .  a game full of insults, "adult" humor, dicks everywhere .  .  .

He finally got what he wanted, but it looks to all of us who saw it that it was a good thing he lost those fights in all of the previous games.  Cheesy
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #37 - 03/29/18 at 09:47:33
 
I wasn't fully aware of the ESP drama, but honestly, the older I get, and the more I've followed Jaffe through his career over tge past 10 years, the more I just think the guy is very out of touch. Yes, hes has some grade A franchises under his belt, but that is with Scott and an entire dev team behind him at times.

I'm not a big fan of his personal views on anything. His political rants on Twitter just annoy me to no end, and his humor is just awful. Drawn to Death had the foundations for a fun core game, but it was trying way too hard to be edgy. Also, he had 3 years to shit that game out, and what we got out of those 4 years was a joke.

We could have an entire conversation on just why the game was ass, but we have a thread on Brawl about that.

How could look down on mobile games, but make your game free-to-play on consoles? Isn't that a bit hypocritical? I think Jaffe just does not play well with others, which is his biggest downfall, because he needs people to counter balance his more retarded ideas. He's now reduced himself to streaming, so people could listen to his drivel in full detail.

I know I should separate one's politics from their work, but in Jaffe's case, both his work and politics suck balls as of late.

I said it before, and I'll say it again. I really don't want him near a Twisted Metal game again. I don't think we need him. Small Brawl was an amazing title despite its flaws. Head-On at its core was also a fine title. They both are missing good ramming haha, but they both capture Twisted Metal at a core level very well without Jaffe's direct involvement.
TMPS3 had a lot of qualities I liked, but it certainly felt like it was missing core TM qualities I liked. The lack of single player with a full character roster, and online co-op campaign was such a let down.
The vehicle roster had some really generic vehicles too. It just missed the mark in a lot of respects, as if the Jaffe and Campbell didn't know what fans wanted. On top of which, Sony having no faith in the product either. It was just a mess, and I think Jaffe is probably a culprit.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #38 - 03/29/18 at 14:47:20
 
Mr.SLaM wrote on 03/29/18 at 09:47:33:
I'm not a big fan of his personal views on anything. His political rants on Twitter just annoy me to no end, and his humor is just awful. Drawn to Death had the foundations for a fun core game, but it was trying way too hard to be edgy. Also, he had 3 years to shit that game out, and what we got out of those 4 years was a joke.

We could have an entire conversation on just why the game was ass, but we have a thread on Brawl about that.

How could look down on mobile games, but make your game free-to-play on consoles? Isn't that a bit hypocritical? I think Jaffe just does not play well with others, which is his biggest downfall, because he needs people to counter balance his more retarded ideas. He's now reduced himself to streaming, so people could listen to his drivel in full detail.

I know I should separate one's politics from their work, but in Jaffe's case, both his work and politics suck balls as of late.
.


Absolutely. I almost hate to keep on criticizing Jaffe, it's like beating a dead horse, but his politics aren't helping his cause. On top of that, he thinks he's some sort of celebrity. Always playing the "creator of Twisted Metal and God of War" card... overplaying his hand though. A little research shows that his original vision for Twisted Metal included flying vehicles and hover cars and controversial stuff in the later titles that had to be scrapped. It's a good thing his power was limited then, it allowed those games to succeed. Then you look at Drawn to Death, a game he had complete control over - and it's a turd.
He is like the George Lucas of video games. Lucas was better when he didn't have total control either. But unlike Lucas, Jaffe hasn't moved on. I think he's convinced himself that Twisted Metal is nothing without him.
So that ego, mixed with his ignorance/stupid political commentary is a dangerous mix. He's quick to think he's always right and like a typical far-leftie from Cali he needs to place blame everywhere except on himself. It showed with Drawn to Death during its beta/private access period. He couldn't take negative feedback, nor couldn't mange the community in a peaceful way. He would however talk with those who always agreed with him and had nothing but praise for his games - yet they weren't the best game testers. A lot of them played quite ruthlessly and would manipulate Jaffe into making changes that would benefit them and hurt new players/players they were threatened by. For instance, there was an attack in the game where you could dash & punch mid-air, without it costing energy. It was a weak ineffective attack but I realized it was an effective way to evade/dodge attacks. This infuriated certain players who were double-teaming against me and losing because I got smart to their bullshit, and they informed Jaffe, claiming that it was unfair, and a change was made where air-dashing drained a player's energy and become so pointless a move it didn't even need to exist anymore. However nothing at the time was done to prevent players from teaming up to another player's disadvantage, especially with that evasion tactic gone, and when I complained about it and said I was going to stop playing if that sort of in-game bullying continued I was the one who got punished - banned for 2 weeks from PSN & perma-banned from the DTD forum on the account I was using. And yet Jaffe and his buddies continued to talk about me on the forum after trying to banish me, so I went on an alt-account to call him out as a hypocrite. I then proceeded to be pretty much the best player on the beta version, ranking on the top 3 of the leaderboards before it was erased, just as a fuck you to them.
And the game failed, no surprise. Even the free-to-play model got dropped last minute, despite objection from Jaffe's fans, although it was released as a free PS Plus game anyway. but PS Plus users didn't care for it. Then Bartlet Jones studio had the nerve to sell DLC too (God of War/Twisted Metal skin packs). Even TMX didn't get DLC and that was a much more profitable title. Only a sucker is putting down ten dollars for some ugly GoW/TMX skins... although I got suckered into buying a PS3 thinking a great Twisted Metal would come out for it. but life doesn't always work out the way it should.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #39 - 03/29/18 at 20:14:23
 
Wow, ok.  So, quick review; Jaffe pulled a number of dick moves.  He created some classic series of games, but only because of the synergy with co-creators.  When he has a product all to himself, it falls flat.

Geez, sounds like he should be a lead singer for a band.

I watch his recent video logs and I agree with most of what he says.  Dude has some great ideas for other games.  But, if another TM gets made without him, I don't think anyone would really care if he was involved or not.  I still like Jaffe and will continue to keep an eye out for stuff he works on, though.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #40 - 03/30/18 at 01:46:45
 
Let's not forget the completely fabricated story about Mort, all told for sympathy and clicks.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #41 - 03/30/18 at 02:56:40
 
I think what a lot of people are forgetting he isn't the sole creator. It was because of Scott and other team members as well. All he is is a designer, WITH scott in the games they made together.

Not to mention the rest of the staff that also had pull.

Don't think I'm defending the man, it's just a fact there.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #42 - 03/30/18 at 11:01:40
 
One of Jaffes game designers worked on TM3 and TM4 at 989 studios.
That was the first indication of what was going to happen at Jaffe's San Diego studio.

You need talent and passion to create a great game and I just don't think Jaffe's studio had that.

Jaffe's opinions are close to mine on many levels and I appreciate that but they don't make great games, talent and passion does and it was so important for Jaffe to have the best talent for his team.

I would like to see Dave and Scott on a winning team again, I know they would be able to direct a new team with great potential to create great games again.

MoshfieldAsylum I read what you had to put up with on 'Drawn to Death', that was bullshit FUCK THOSE GUYS.










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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #43 - 04/02/18 at 12:12:49
 
I still hold a positive view of Jaffe as a developer. Drawn to Death was fun for what it was but the game needed to be free to play and they initially built the game to be that way, sadly they changed the game from free to play to a digital type game and that crippled the games ability to be successful.

Twisted Metal PS3 was in my mind a good game at its core. Homing issues and other gameplay issues existed but the bosses were super fun, the graphics and style nailed it, the core mechanics were really good in my opinion, the level design was the best of the series, and the car selection was great. The online and balancing issues killed the game, sure issues existed but I had a blast when I could get the game to work and enjoyed most of the single-player experience.

Overall I think that Jaffe still has a good mind for developing video games he just needs to work with a good team that can harness his creativity. That's why he worked so well with Campbell, Campbell was an X's and O's type guy. Campbell knew how to get what Jaffe wanted to function well. But Campbell without Jaffe just lacks an X factor. TMHO was a good game but it just seemed to be too focused on reliving TM2 and it lacked something creatively.

But with the Jaffe and Campbell relationship not being there professionally (I am not sure if they still co-exist on a personal level or not) I am not sure who I would rather have manning the Twisted Metal series. My dream team would be to have Sony Santa Monica work on it with Jaffe being a creative consultant or have Campbell man the team and have Jaffe just do the story.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #44 - 04/05/18 at 01:44:13
 
tmfan89 wrote on 04/02/18 at 12:12:49:
TMHO was a good game but it just seemed to be too focused on reliving TM2 and it lacked something creatively.


In my opinion, there was only 1 major flaw with Head On.  that was the stage music.  Some tracks were perfect, but most seemed very ill-fitting.  I would actually turn off the stage music in the settings and play that way.  Other than that, I really love the game and think it's better than Black or 2012.
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