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New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal" (Read 6735 times)
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #15 - 02/14/18 at 19:17:28
 
I agree.

Lets hope he does well on his next project.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #16 - 02/17/18 at 12:33:14
 
Muddeh wrote on 02/07/18 at 02:21:56:
Obligatory topic for the video Jaffe recently uploaded concerning TM.



Not much new really. but it is encouraging to hear that TM Black was one of the highest selling PS2 digital games.

I think if we are looking at Twisted Metal's possible return a TM2 HD remaster with online play would be the way to go. A 15$ digital game seems like a good price point if the online features were good. A rerelease of TMPS3 with worked out online at a 15$ price point could work but I think you want to go back to the most popular game in the series to really gauge fan interest.

Then if that were to sell well you could consider a 30$ digital new TM with a simplistic story mode (2 simple bosses, comic book style cut scenes, and just straightforward deathmatch) and a heavy focus on online play (But with local multiplayer.)

I think that would scratch the itch of as many people as possible. A simple story mode written by Jaffe gives those lore and single player fans their satisfaction. Then the online play gives the game legs and hits the itch for the fans of the series who want a good online experience. Toss in local multiplayer and you make as many people happy as possible.

The graphics don't have to be insanely good, just make it a half a step above TMPS3 and I think that would satisfy people. The story mode could be kept simple to lower costs too.

Overall I am glad to see Jaffe keep the fans updated as much as possible. But right now the franchises best hope is an HD remaster of TM2, if that sells well then I think we have a case for optimism. TMPS3 sold solid about just over a million copies, but in the age of HD development that's not that good. So I think smaller scale projects are a good way to go if the franchise has a future which I hope it does.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #17 - 02/17/18 at 12:41:21
 
Mr.SLaM wrote on 02/07/18 at 16:23:13:
While I'd love both a Crash Bandicoot style remaster of Twisted Metal 1 and 2, or a Twisted Metal PS3 remaster fix, I have given up on Sony or Jaffe delivering what Twisted Metal fans want.

We don't want a garbage micro transaction fueled free to play shit pile.
I don't want Rocket League with loot boxes and hyper competitive multiplayer.
I don't mind a healthy multiplayer keeping players engaged, but if it's at the expense of losing single player, and harming core gameplay, I'm out.

I've actually just been working on my own car combat title with a few folks because we want to make a title we want.


I think a HD remaster of TM2 is the best we can hope for at this moment. It would be fairly affordable to do and there is an audience for it (The most popular game in the franchise.) Give me a visually upgraded version of that game (Similar to what they did with Crash) and load it up with solid online play and I will be happy.

Then maybe if that sells well you can get a smaller budget 20-30$ new TM game that focuses on gameplay rather than graphics. Hell, upgrade the TMPS3 engine and I think you can create something cheap enough that can sell really well.

But right now the franchise's only hope is an HD remaster selling well.
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Infernal
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #18 - 03/14/18 at 22:23:27
 
Does the TMB digital sales include the voucher codes from TMX? Regardless, it was good to hear that it was in the top three.

A remaster of either one or both titles would be the next direction. I feel like there needs to be a refresher of what TM really is for the casual fans who have heard of TM before. TMX didn't do a great job in attracting newcomers but we all know that haha.

Should we get a new TM, I don't know if I want Jaffe in the mix again or leave it up to Campbell.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #19 - 03/15/18 at 15:46:19
 
Infernal wrote on 03/14/18 at 22:23:27:
Should we get a new TM, I don't know if I want Jaffe in the mix again or leave it up to Campbell.


My vote? Neither.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #20 - 03/18/18 at 10:33:57
 
Infernal wrote on 03/14/18 at 22:23:27:
Does the TMB digital sales include the voucher codes from TMX? Regardless, it was good to hear that it was in the top three.

A remaster of either one or both titles would be the next direction. I feel like there needs to be a refresher of what TM really is for the casual fans who have heard of TM before. TMX didn't do a great job in attracting newcomers but we all know that haha.

Should we get a new TM, I don't know if I want Jaffe in the mix again or leave it up to Campbell.


Black's sales numbers are for the PS4 digital store. The Black code that was given with early copies of TMX was for the PS3 download store, so that wouldn't have any impact on the new sales. I would like to see Jaffe and a small team from Sony Santa Monica handle a TM2 HD remaster. Have Campbell on as an advisor for sure but get Jaffe to handle the series.

I know Jaffe hasn't done a great game since God of War but to me Twisted Metal and Jaffe kind of need each other at the moment and it would be a one last shot at redemption deal for both in my mind.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #21 - 03/18/18 at 19:48:13
 
https://www.psu.com/news/twisted-metal-ps4-return-sweet-tooth-demolition-derby/ New article about the state of Twisted Metal.
and http://www.gamerevolution.com/news/375493-david-jaffe-reveals-canceled-twisted-m... an article about the cancelled Jaffe game which would have been another Drawn to Death but with superheroes (the article calls it 'twisted metal with superheroes' but they're using Jaffe's words).

The thing is I don't want Jaffe involved in a future Twisted Metal, and I'm not the only one. I don't think Scott Campbell would want to work with him either considering what went down between them with EatSleepPlay, but I wouldn't mind Scott C.'s involvement (as long as he finally realizes sniper rifles in TM is a stupid idea, heh).
I think 'Drawn to Death' and the Bartlet Jones studio was a failure mostly because of Jaffe's ideas and attitude honestly. It wasn't bad reviews that killed that game, and it wasn't Sony's fault for not promoting the heck out of a below average arena shooter with a small-to-nonexistent fanbase. The game made no money and nobody plays it. Having Jaffe involved in a future TM is too much a risk. It'd probably end up being another disaster. He has already contributed his concepts and designs for Twisted Metal, a long time ago, so why would he still be needed? his game-play ideas are not that good, it's in part what sunk Drawn to Death. and funny how Jaffe suddenly wants to talk about Twisted Metal now that he has no studio. any time anyone tried to talk about TM to him on the Drawn to Death forum he'd just ignore the comment. if people complained about TMX's issues to him on Twitter, he'd ignore the comment. But suddenly we're supposed to believe he has been passionate about Twisted Metal all along? Fuck that.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #22 - 03/18/18 at 23:20:37
 
tmfan89 wrote on 03/18/18 at 10:33:57:
Black's sales numbers are for the PS4 digital store. The Black code that was given with early copies of TMX was for the PS3 download store, so that wouldn't have any impact on the new sales. I would like to see Jaffe and a small team from Sony Santa Monica handle a TM2 HD remaster. Have Campbell on as an advisor for sure but get Jaffe to handle the series.

I know Jaffe hasn't done a great game since God of War but to me Twisted Metal and Jaffe kind of need each other at the moment and it would be a one last shot at redemption deal for both in my mind.


Thatís like saying we need cancer. Iím with Mosh. Iíd rather the series stay dead than have another Jaffe version.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #23 - 03/19/18 at 01:53:24
 
Let's be realistic. The overwhelming majority of Twisted Metal players are casuals that don't hold a negative view of Jaffe. In fact, I can almost guarantee that if a new TM were announced and Jaffe weren't a part of it, the game would immediately be stigmatized for not having its original creative director and immediately face an uphill battle to prove itself as an authentic instalment in the series.

Even though we know otherwise, there's practically no gaming news outlets or pundits that have ever presented a narrative that would suggest Jaffe was a root cause of TM 2012's, or even Drawn to Death's major flaws. I wouldn't want to see Jaffe direct another TM but I think it's integral that he be involved in the project, even if just as a consultant, simply in order to have his name in the credits so that the game isn't dismissed with the assumption it will flop like III and 4 did.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #24 - 03/19/18 at 03:51:51
 
Muddeh wrote on 03/19/18 at 01:53:24:
Let's be realistic. The overwhelming majority of Twisted Metal players are casuals that don't hold a negative view of Jaffe. In fact, I can almost guarantee that if a new TM were announced and Jaffe weren't a part of it, the game would immediately be stigmatized for not having its original creative director and immediately face an uphill battle to prove itself as an authentic instalment in the series.

Even though we know otherwise, there's practically no gaming news outlets or pundits that have ever presented a narrative that would suggest Jaffe was a root cause of TM 2012's, or even Drawn to Death's major flaws. I wouldn't want to see Jaffe direct another TM but I think it's integral that he be involved in the project, even if just as a consultant, simply in order to have his name in the credits so that the game isn't dismissed with the assumption it will flop like III and 4 did.


Who cares? Iím not basing my opinion on what the masses want. If heís involved Iíd rather it stay dead.

However, you are WAY over rating his selling power. His own recent history proves it doesnít mean much. The only video game series Iím aware of that has any sort of truly close tie to its director is Metal Gear, and yet even that series has proven it will still be financially successful without Kojima.

God of War, TM 989 (which were huge sellers by the way)  and TMHO all prove Jaffe isnít needed for sales. TM could go on just fine, and likely even better, without him.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #25 - 03/19/18 at 06:59:10
 
I was responding to Mosh whether or not it would be realistic to have Jaffe involved with another game. Your opinion is fine but unrelated since the series is dead in your eyes anyways.

Am I really overrating his influence? If you go to Drawn to Death's Metacritic page, five of the seven featured critic reviews not only have Jaffe's name in the review, but in the review abstract as well. How many other games' review abstracts on Metacritic mention the director, let alone that many times? It's equal to Kojima's presence on MGSV: The Phantom Pain's Metacritic page, as his name is also mentioned in five of seven featured critic reviews' abstracts.

In fact, Metal Gear Survive is a great case study of what could potentially result if Jaffe isn't involved. Survive will likely still be profitable for Konami since they reused the same engine and a lot of assets so it likely didn't cost that much to develop it in the first place, but it has been reported that it only sold 5% of copies sold by MGSV: The Phantom Pain at debut.

Admittedly, Kojima's absence wasn't the sole reason for the lack of sales considering that Survive is a spin-off and there's already a lot of consumer angst towards Konami that's been brewing for years. Still, it's comparable to Jaffe and the TM series since there's already a stigma against games Jaffe wasn't involved in. It's even perpetuated in The Dark Past documentary in regards to III and 4.

The sales success of III and 4 hardly matters since it was both a time before the internet was the main source for game previews/coverage and it was still before Jaffe had enough success to have name recognition. Head-On is pretty negligible too since it was still developed by Incognito, and it wasn't until after God of War that Jaffe had high-tier name recognition. God of War III was another acclaimed release so there was no stigma associated with Jaffe parting from the series. TM is a completely different story.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #26 - 03/19/18 at 19:01:10
 
That's cool you were responding to Mosh. I was responding to you. Me believing it's dead is completely irrelevant.

Your analysis conveniently overlooks the fact that none of his recent games, INCLUDING Twisted Metal have sold, and we have Twisted Metals that sold well without him. God of War sold even better without him too.

Keep writing pages of dialogue to argue your point, but the fact is the actual evidence says he's not necessary, and even makes things worse.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #27 - 03/19/18 at 20:59:43
 
Muddeh wrote on 03/19/18 at 01:53:24:
Let's be realistic. The overwhelming majority of Twisted Metal players are casuals that don't hold a negative view of Jaffe. In fact, I can almost guarantee that if a new TM were announced and Jaffe weren't a part of it, the game would immediately be stigmatized for not having its original creative director and immediately face an uphill battle to prove itself as an authentic instalment in the series.

Even though we know otherwise, there's practically no gaming news outlets or pundits that have ever presented a narrative that would suggest Jaffe was a root cause of TM 2012's, or even Drawn to Death's major flaws. I wouldn't want to see Jaffe direct another TM but I think it's integral that he be involved in the project, even if just as a consultant, simply in order to have his name in the credits so that the game isn't dismissed with the assumption it will flop like III and 4 did.


get the fuck outta here lol. did anyone complain of Mike Giam's lack of involvement in the TM series despite being a co-creator of Twisted Metal?

and I am being realistic, not emotional. nobody is going to mind Jaffe not being part of a TM game. plenty of casuals like non-jaffe TM games (TM4, Small Brawl, Head-On), and even PS All Stars Battle Royale didn't feel Jaffe was necessary as a consultant and that game's more successful than TMX.

and how do casuals = people who give a fuck about Jaffe? That is kind of a contradiction, no? Casuals don't give a fuck about anything except if a game is good or not.

And if the failure of TMX and Drawn to Death is not in part because of Jaffe, then who? What kind of world we living in where people aren't held accountable for what they do? People lost their jobs because him u know. Oh, but it's not his fault, is it? He only founded both those studios and made the games.

But I don't really want to argue this endlessly. If there are many fans who still want a Jaffe game, fine. I used to be that person. Just be careful what you wish for. You just might get it, & regret it.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #28 - 03/19/18 at 22:02:10
 
@Malefactor

Your first post after mine immediately began with defending your opinion that the series is better off dead if Jaffe were to be involved in a future game, when I wasnít challenging that stance at all. Iím just assuring if you that if you donít want another TM with Jaffe, thatís fine. Iíve mentioned I would prefer him to not be involved as well. Smiley

TM 2012 definitely undersold overall, but it did have a decent launch considering its competition at the time. It could have potentially been an even greater trainwreck if Jaffe wasnít involved and the question of whether itíd have been a legit TM was floating around causing the game to even be avoided at launch. As for Drawn to Death, I can almost guarantee it wouldnít have received a quarter of the media coverage and community involvement if Jaffeís name wasnít attached to the game. His involvement was one of the sole reasons anyone cared at all about a bland run-of-the-mill arena shooter from a completely unknown studio.

@Mosh

Quit twisting shit. Mike Giam doesn't have name recognition, so that's a useless analogy. I already mentioned why TMs from decades ago don't matter, because Jaffe didn't have widespread name recognition yet. By casuals, I mean those uninformed that Jaffe's role as director was one of the root causes of those games' failures, and buy into the narrative that games media presents that constantly presents his involvement as substantial and in a positive light.

I sure as hell am not going up to bat for Jaffe, so quit going off on unrelated tangents. He fucked up hard and I can't make it any clearer that I would prefer for him to not be directly involved in another TM. All I'm saying is that not only does his name have selling power, but there also already an unjust preexisting stigma among the uninformed masses that games that games without Jaffe's involvement fail. It doesnít mean that the game would absolutely be damned to underperform, but it could result in an uphill battle to prove itself as a legit TM to the masses who still credit TMís success to Jaffe, which could be a big problem for a game from such a niche genre.
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Re: New Video from Jaffe: "The State Of Twisted Metal"
Reply #29 - 03/19/18 at 22:57:22
 
Fine. We can agree Jaffe gets media attention.

However, it doesnít seem to translate to success.
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