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TM 1+2 Modding thread (Read 326571 times)
†Adonael
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #840 - 04/25/20 at 00:04:30
 
His profile has always said Ohio and he spoke pretty good english. I doubt he was russian. There was a AiC I believe his name was, who was russian
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #841 - 04/28/20 at 22:21:41
 
Anyone had trouble changing the .dpc before? They seem to revert back when ever I load the game?
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aybe
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #842 - 06/04/20 at 00:19:31
 
Did you know that Twisted Metal 1 Japanese version for PSX had a SYM file next to it ?

For skeptical ones, it's not only PsyQ symbols but all symbols:

Code:
create_DEATHSPEAR_missile
create_FIRE_missile
create_FREEZE_missile
create_GHOST_missile
create_HOMING_missile
create_LOS_missile
create_POWER_missile
create_REAR_missile
create_SINGING_missile
create_stars
create_SWARM_missile
 


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†Adonael
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #843 - 06/05/20 at 02:23:29
 
It's good to see you around Aybe. Did you have any luck ripping TM1 models?

And if you are interested we have a discord community dedicated to TM1. I plan on rebalance some things once I have the time. (Weapon damages, etc.)

We would be glad to have you. We are trying to build a place with all TM1 knowledge in one spot.

Discord:
https://discord.gg/ZfacgpV
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #844 - 06/06/20 at 15:00:39
 
I found a couple of posts on another forum which show how to listen to the sound effects from the Twisted Metal PC games. Not sure if it helps with modding though.

VAB files (not from PS1) [Twisted Metal 1 and Air Assault (Warhawk)]

GRY files [Twisted Metal 2, Jet Moto, and Outwars]
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aybe
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #845 - 06/07/20 at 03:45:28
 
†Adonael wrote on 06/05/20 at 02:23:29:
It's good to see you around Aybe. Did you have any luck ripping TM1 models?

And if you are interested we have a discord community dedicated to TM1. I plan on rebalance some things once I have the time. (Weapon damages, etc.)

We would be glad to have you. We are trying to build a place with all TM1 knowledge in one spot.

Discord:
https://discord.gg/ZfacgpV


I've lost my Unity project where I had an already made viewer ... looked at DMD again to try get my parser back online, I have 100% tests passed up to 00FF blocks which contains models ... but well, my idea of a modern engine for TM will probably never happen ...

I remember back then when I first came in, I was so motivated that I made the impossible: understand these files instead of blindly writing to byte arrays at some offsets ... guess what, many times I've tried to push him so we unite but the guy always ignored me, keeping on doing his cryptic stuff so at some point I realized I was completely wasting my time.

His project, like many others out there, is a monster that only him can really understand.

As for Discord, I just realized I lost my 2AF and my account is lost forever  Grin
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aybe
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #846 - 06/07/20 at 03:48:39
 
SpectreMissile wrote on 06/06/20 at 15:00:39:
I found a couple of posts on another forum which show how to listen to the sound effects from the Twisted Metal PC games. Not sure if it helps with modding though.

VAB files (not from PS1) [Twisted Metal 1 and Air Assault (Warhawk)]

GRY files [Twisted Metal 2, Jet Moto, and Outwars]


Myself I would rather focus on PSX version for many reasons,
- symbols are now available on Ghidra which is a huge help with C decompilation !
- PSX files are more homogeneous, they're not a rewrite like DPC is and therefore easier to focus on
- no$psx GPU debugger is extremely handy

PS

With PSX there won't be an extra layer to accomodate for DirectX like there is on PC, which is radically different than PSX you'll admit.

And there are plently of tools for PSX like no$psx, ghidra, tim2view, docs, along symbols ... for the PC you get none of that, trying to use IDA for it in a VM does work but it has its own downsides too
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aybe
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #847 - 06/07/20 at 04:18:09
 
Now here's quick info about DMD while it's still fresh again on my mind,

  • it's not TMD at all !
  • it's a mix of PMD and HMD but a version that never been made public, you can see that the version number from disassembly is higher that what's on SDK docs [1]
  • that supposedly mysterious field at start is not ! it's the date/time in UNIX format, circa '96
  • it's definitely hierarchical data like HMD, because when you start tweaking PSX games you quickly realize there are tons of dupe models but in fact these are only LOD models, you see that very clearly in no$psx, a car very far is nothing more than a textured cube
  • like in Unity, transforms are hierarchical so position are relative, this is why when you try to render a level it looks weird unless you account for parent transforms
  • trying to read 100% of the file as I did figure out with unit tests will not work, there are pointers in the file pointing outside it, i.e. to some memory location in PSX, some loaded resource whatever it is
  • also, it's impossible to guess the exact block size after normals, the length isn't just there, you just have to read what you need then forget about these zeroes (or not !), basically they do like I've recently seen in Quake source code, they read a bunch of bytes, cast them to a struct and eventually to another struct -> extremely confusing regarding an approach one would have today, this is why it's very hard to follow in disassembly, everything has been read already then it's all about offsets and at some early point insanely hard to follow, but as I said, symbol files are extremely useful since we have method names the guys wrote back then !


Your best friends : LibRef47.pdf, File Format 47.pdf, LibOver47.pdf at http://www.psxdev.net/downloads.html and ofc no$psx.

And for VAB/VH/VB, there are some cases where the sample rate won't be in the files so it's in the executable.

Last thing why I say prefer PSX over PC is that they deliberately corrupted TIM files headers, probably to prevent some people to try decipher them ... they have a 9 while it should be 8 or 1 ... so who knows what else they changed.

[1] not as complex as HMD, it's 100 pages in the docs, but not as simple as PMD, also, maybe they wrote their own packet driver because none match the ones in the docs, however, they aren't too difficult to guess, mostly quads ... and again, no$psx is gold when it comes to understanding it, you can know exactly what type of polygon/mode is used for a particular thing on the screen  Cool
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aybe
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #848 - 06/07/20 at 04:30:27
 
One last thing for you guys who'd like to look at symbols



Now of course, you won't magically get the real source code BUT those real method names are extremely useful since you know what part of the game you're looking at, it's instantly less of a hurdle to try understand a part of the game.

And for no$psx, when you use the GPU debugger, scroll to item of interest until you see it adorned in red on output, then, those register values on right are explained in no$psx docs + you get better understanding by spotting these on the SDK docs.
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aybe
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #849 - 06/07/20 at 05:20:52
 
OK GUYS

Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

I've cleaned up the repository and uploaded it for you, fork it, comment it, it's all the work I did recently on DMD:

https://github.com/aybe/OpenTwisted

Look at the README, I've explained things,

You will see that in fact there are only really 6 different types of data structures in all TM1 DMD levels, when you know that it's already some sort of relief  Grin

And OFC, with Issues tab you guys will get instant email notification whereas it's not the case for this forum. Keep in mind that you can use GitHub not only for programming stuff, in fact you have your own little forum with storage as well, fast and free !

Enjoy and I will try to help providing I have some free time.

Smiley

...
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #850 - 06/07/20 at 23:07:17
 
Hi guys,

I've been able to enhance the project a bit  Smiley

  • hierarchical structure is done up to models but not from models to data yet Grin
  • resolved all incoming calls to those data blocks -> I know what data belongs to what, or at least what comes right before them (maybe it'll be another DMDNode type or not, I dunno, I didn't do any hex hunting today !)
  • started code reuse and upgraded a few things
  • more logging
  • and more stats!!!


Look at this !

Code:
C:\Users\Aybe\source\repos\OpenTwisted\.twisted\TM1PSUSA\UADMD\CARS.DMD
6/7/2020 10:59:00 PM
Addresses:
45196
53752
62844
72156
80184
87936
96048
111288
121540
131156
140380
152072
152672
DMDNodeROOT, Children: 13, Position: 76
	DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 152672
		DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 152100
	DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 152072
		DMDNode040BXXXX, Children: 1, Position: 152048
			DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 4, Position: 152008
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 151984
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 2, Position: 151940
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 150552
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 150412
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 150388
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 150348
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 150216
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 4, Position: 150180
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 149696
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 148860
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 145692
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 140864
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 140840
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 140408
	DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 140380
		DMDNode040BXXXX, Children: 1, Position: 140356
			DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 4, Position: 140316
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 140292
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 2, Position: 140248
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 138860
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 138720
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 138696
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 138656
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 138524
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 4, Position: 138488
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 138152
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 137504
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 135652
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 131632
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 131608
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 131184
	DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 131156
		DMDNode040BXXXX, Children: 1, Position: 131132
			DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 3, Position: 131096
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 131072
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 2, Position: 131028
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 129640
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 129404
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 129380
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 129340
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 129208
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 4, Position: 129172
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 128920
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 128344
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 126484
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 121568
	DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 121540
		DMDNode040BXXXX, Children: 1, Position: 121516
			DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 4, Position: 121476
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 121452
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 2, Position: 121408
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 120020
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 119880
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 2, Position: 119852
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 119256
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 117608
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 117584
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 117544
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 117208
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 5, Position: 117168
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 116740
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 116072
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 115340
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 114232
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 111316
	DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 111288
		DMDNode040BXXXX, Children: 1, Position: 111264
			DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 6, Position: 111216
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 111192
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 2, Position: 111148
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 110432
						DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 0, Position: 110408
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 110384
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 110344
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 110228
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 110204
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 109604
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 109580
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 108776
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 108752
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 107068
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 2, Position: 107040
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 103624
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 96076
	DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 96048
		DMDNode040BXXXX, Children: 1, Position: 96024
			DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 4, Position: 95984
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 95960
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 2, Position: 95916
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 94528
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 94388
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 94364
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 94324
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 94192
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 4, Position: 94156
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 93820
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 93212
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 91564
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 88332
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 88308
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 87964
	DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 87936
		DMDNode040BXXXX, Children: 1, Position: 87912
			DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 5, Position: 87868
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 87844
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 2, Position: 87800
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 86412
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 86272
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 86248
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 86208
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 86080
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 86056
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 85544
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 85520
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 84024
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 84000
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 80212
	DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 80184
		DMDNode040BXXXX, Children: 1, Position: 80160
			DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 5, Position: 80116
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 80092
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 2, Position: 80048
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 78660
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 78520
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 78496
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 78456
						DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 78324
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 78300
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 77468
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 77444
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 75752
				DMDNode0207XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 75728
					DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 72184
....
Total nodes: 241
	DMDNode00FFXXXX: 103
	DMDNode0107XXXX: 62
	DMDNode0207XXXX: 60
	DMDNode040BXXXX: 13
	DMDNode0903XXXX: 2
	DMDNodeROOT: 1
 



We can already draw many conclusions,

040B blocks seem to define a model, we have 12 cars in DMD + probably 1 root, makes sense as it's hierarchical  Grin

0107 and 0207 these act as chain links, they're absolutely everywhere !!! i hate these little structs because they're hard to figure in general, maybe transforms ?

00FF we know these are models, and confirms my LOD thinking, many LODs for each model

XXXX basically means any two 16-bit numbers after the DMD node type -> unknown

So you see, 241 nodes only for 12 cars ... on levels it's like +6K nodes  Cry

I remember that on my old viewer I've lost it was very cryptic, some models were only the wheels but back then I didn't really understand where to pick the highest LOD model, it appeared to be randomly put.

Also, see on levels like below, there are dead ends for 0107 but also models nested within models !!! really crazy... This game is full of traps  Grin Grin Grin


And see some of the positions, some models are as low as 80 bytes, e.g. 1 polygon, 4 vertices, 1 normal -> a quad ...

Code:
								DMDNode040BXXXX, Children: 1, Position: 552540
									DMDNode0903XXXX, Children: 7, Position: 552504
										DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 0, Position: 552480
										DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 552400
										DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 552320
										DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 552288
											DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 552120
										DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 552088
											DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 551920
										DMDNode0107XXXX, Children: 1, Position: 551888
											DMDNode00FFXXXX, Children: 0, Position: 551720

 



Last thing so you guys understand how I do that, basically I do live unit testing, which means that tests continuously run as I type so I can try things very easily and get instant results  Smiley If it works, it works, as it's tested instantly against all TM1 versions ... very very cool Cool

cheers Wink
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #851 - 06/07/20 at 23:46:21
 
One last thing for today   Grin Grin Grin

Now I print the tree directly as it's being read, and you really get a clear understanding of what's unknown and where it sits Smiley

So, maybe ReadGeometry is not about geometry at all in fact ... I wonder why it occurs for 0207 and not always for 00FF ..........

Code:
						DMDNode0107XXXX, Depth: 6, Children: 0, Position: 581840
							DMDNode0207XXXX, Depth: 7, Children: 0, Position: 581140
ReadGeometry
								DMDNode00FFXXXX, Depth: 8, Children: 0, Position: 580500
ReadGeometry
								DMDNode00FFXXXX, Depth: 8, Children: 0, Position: 580708
							DMDNode0207XXXX, Depth: 7, Children: 0, Position: 581812
ReadGeometry
								DMDNode00FFXXXX, Depth: 8, Children: 0, Position: 581168
ReadGeometry
								DMDNode00FFXXXX, Depth: 8, Children: 0, Position: 581420
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Depth: 5, Children: 0, Position: 583620
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
0x08FF0000: DMDNode0107XXXX
			DMDNode0207XXXX, Depth: 3, Children: 0, Position: 583888
ReadGeometry
0x0B060000: DMDNode0207XXXX
				DMDNode0107XXXX, Depth: 4, Children: 0, Position: 583720
					DMDNode0107XXXX, Depth: 5, Children: 0, Position: 581872
						DMDNode0107XXXX, Depth: 6, Children: 0, Position: 559060
							DMDNode0207XXXX, Depth: 7, Children: 0, Position: 558044
ReadGeometry
								DMDNode00FFXXXX, Depth: 8, Children: 0, Position: 556368
ReadGeometry
								DMDNode00FFXXXX, Depth: 8, Children: 0, Position: 557260
ReadGeometry
								DMDNode00FFXXXX, Depth: 8, Children: 0, Position: 557728
							DMDNode0207XXXX, Depth: 7, Children: 0, Position: 558600
ReadGeometry
								DMDNode00FFXXXX, Depth: 8, Children: 0, Position: 558076
							DMDNode0207XXXX, Depth: 7, Children: 0, Position: 558876
ReadGeometry
 



night
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #852 - 06/08/20 at 15:35:53
 
I find all this highly interesting. I just wish I understood more about file formats so I could do something more useful haha.
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #853 - 06/08/20 at 17:09:05
 
well, i think i am going to abandon ... it's too complex  Cry

i've pushed my latest work in case someone else comes in
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Re: TM 1+2 Modding thread
Reply #854 - 06/09/20 at 00:20:12
 
Thats a shame. Thanks for sharing though Aybe!
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