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Message started by Thumpy on 02/06/17 at 22:13:03

Title: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Thumpy on 02/06/17 at 22:13:03
http://www.ign.com/videos/2017/02/06/drawn-to-death-official-inside-look-with-david-jaffe-video

Based on what I've seen so far I'm not convinced that I will even like this game.

I will check it out and give it a chance, it seems more than just a shooter.

I'll keep an open mind to this game but I'm not sold on it yet.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Muddeh on 02/10/17 at 14:11:27
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8E_zMLCRNg

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Mr.DooM on 03/30/17 at 06:54:27
Now we know it's Tuesday.

Who's gonna join?

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by †Adonael on 03/30/17 at 12:03:26
I'll give it a few rounds but I can't promise I'll stick around.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by MoshfieldAsylum on 03/30/17 at 21:50:11
I doubt what is being released is much different than the beta/"private access" that had been available, so I already pretty much played through it, but I'll play a few rounds, look for some TMA peeps to play with, but I already know I'm not a fan. I bet the game will have messed up server issues too. The game had never been tested with a lot of players online before. For real, I don't think they ever had that server with more than 20-30 people. That server is going to crap out and Sony San Diego will be too busy with MLB The Show 17 to do much to help, just like how TMX's server was super crappy and Sony Santa Monica was unable to do much about it. I have a feeling this DtD launch will be as bad as TMX, the community will dwindle after a month or two, they will have to cancel DLC if it's not successful, and then Jaffe will beg Sony to let him do another game that he will take another 4 years to work on.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Mr.DooM on 03/30/17 at 22:03:01

MoshfieldAsylum wrote on 03/30/17 at 21:50:11:
I doubt what is being released is much different than the beta/"private access" that had been available, so I already pretty much played through it, but I'll play a few rounds, look for some TMA peeps to play with, but I already know I'm not a fan. I bet the game will have messed up server issues too. The game had never been tested with a lot of players online before. For real, I don't think they ever had that server with more than 20-30 people. That server is going to crap out and Sony San Diego will be too busy with MLB The Show 17 to do much to help, just like how TMX's server was super crappy and Sony Santa Monica was unable to do much about it. I have a feeling this DtD launch will be as bad as TMX, the community will dwindle after a month or two, they will have to cancel DLC if it's not successful, and then Jaffe will beg Sony to let him do another game that he will take another 4 years to work on.



Sadly, that makes perfect sense.
Now the server was shit to me and I couldn't play with any of you guys, my hopes are that it's at least slightly better now since their excuse had something to do with EU release of the beta.

I really hope it'll work out, though. Will be able to see familiar faces again.


Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by †Adonael on 04/05/17 at 10:57:50
I played ot and enjoyed it way more than I thought I was going to.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by MoshfieldAsylum on 04/06/17 at 00:50:21

†Adonael wrote on 04/05/17 at 10:57:50:
I played ot and enjoyed it way more than I thought I was going to.


I take it you only played Unranked mode so far? Because Unranked is far more tolerable because the rules are simpler (kills-only scoring). It's Ranked mode that fucking sucks. The game tries too hard to be a competitive game, sucks the fun out of the experience, and the end result is an unbalanced game  that isn't fun for too long even if you can get past the ugly graphics & terrible writing/poor humor. There is some limited enjoyment though I suppose.
You can add me on my alt-PSN account (BlackfieldAsylum) if you want, maybe we can start up a DTD session.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by †Adonael on 04/08/17 at 04:47:22
I play both rank and unranked. I really only have massive issues when Im an Idiot. Which is 35% of the time.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Malefactor on 04/08/17 at 06:16:00
It's being savaged in a lot of its reviews, both critical and commentary by real players.

I genuinely feel bad for the guy and his team who I'm sure worked real hard on it.

What stands out to me is, from what I've read (as I bought it on PS Plus in order to throw my free support behind the guy - he does get money from it - but I have no interest in booting it up) he basically doubled down on all of the complaints that we gave the 2012 TMX.

My feeling is the Incog team, and to a lesser extent the ESP team, held him back on some of his worst tendencies.  Now that he owns his team and gets final say, you can see his mark throughout the game.  Openly mean and hostile to the players, overly crass without any clever humor behind it, completely unbalanced characters with a RIDICULOUS degree of health causing the matches to draw out WAY too long . . .

It's sad really.  We complained ages ago.  He wrote us off for it, called us the negative ones, then doubled down on his "wisdom" and now the whole world is calling him out on it.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by The Truth on 04/08/17 at 10:28:22
I think it is safe to say Jaffe didn't let us down and this game bombed harder than those tomahawk missiles in Syria.

All the reviews I've seen so far have trashed it and activity on various forums for the game is lower than it should be. I've seen various complaints of matchmaking/connection issues and crashes. No idea if it is as widespread as TMX. It also seems to be horribly balanced. Apparently a bug that makes you invincible made it to the launch of the game and people think it is hackers LOL. I know there was talk of hackers during the beta, maybe it was this bug?!

Tbh as long as they don't abandon it, it will probably do at least ok money wise. The game does have a cash shop right or did they scrap that? If so people that like and play it a lot will dump money into it. As well as I'm sure they will make changes and improve the game some what.

Still though it is a pretty shitty job for as long as it has been in development. Not to mention how long it has been in beta.

I wonder if Jaffe is still going to keep up his obsession with being edgy after getting trashed for it.

My favorite parts from IGN's review was...


Quote:
"It’s as if developer The Bartlet Jones Supernatural Detective Agency has taken the kind of in-game chat awfulness that makes so many of us take off our headsets and mute everybody when playing online, and made it part of the game itself."

"All of this is really a massive shame. Despite all its flaws as a shooter there’s some depth and rewarding complexity in Drawn to Death, if you take the time to read between the lines. Unfortunately, it can’t help taking a dump on the page and shoving your face in it every time you try."

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Archminion on 04/08/17 at 21:12:10
cue Jaffe's anticipated rant at press/withdrawal of online presence (temp)

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by The Truth on 04/09/17 at 01:30:31
I'm waiting for him to say "I guess people just aren't that into arena shooters".

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Malefactor on 04/09/17 at 03:17:34

The Truth wrote on 04/09/17 at 01:30:31:
I'm waiting for him to say "I guess people just aren't that into arena shooters".


Okay, this one, in the words of ages past, wins the internets.  ;D

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Mr.DooM on 04/09/17 at 03:54:21

The Truth wrote on 04/08/17 at 10:28:22:
...bombed harder than those tomahawk missiles in Syria.


HEY!

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Muddeh on 04/09/17 at 09:55:54
People aren't going to purchase a PS4 or subscribe to PS Plus for an arena shooter, and especially not one that is fee-to-play and hasn't done well with critics (thus far). It seems like this is yet another blunder of a Sony-exclusive title. I respect the team's ambitions and how they appear to be pretty active in terms of support though.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Archminion on 04/09/17 at 15:21:14
It will be interesting to see how Jaffe reacts and handles to this going forward.

He hasn't had a high scoring game since GOW and TMX just barely pipped a decent score.

Maybe he's had his day?

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Thumpy on 04/09/17 at 20:24:01
http://www.ign.com/articles/2017/04/08/drawn-to-death-review

The faults in this game seem to be similar to those in another game I purchased about five years ago.

This game designer could have learned from the other game designer, and a better game would have been created.

Designers from these games should learn to communicate with each other more off-feh-ten....communication is so important.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by MoshfieldAsylum on 04/11/17 at 00:33:18
http://www.digitallydownloaded.net/2017/04/review-drawn-to-death-sony-playstation-4.html

Here's a great review

"...Even South Park, which is utterly crass and quite explicitly aims for the lowest common denominator, is a genuine work of transgressive art, as it generally asks some pretty hard socio-cultural questions beneath that base humour. Or, at least the early show did. I stopped watching South Park a very long time ago, so I’m not sure where the show has gone since. The point is; transgressive art doesn't need to be high and lofty in intent. Stuff like South Park show that gutter trash can work as transgressive art, and be remarkably effective at it.

Drawn to Death is gutter trash, but it fails to be transgressive on any genuine level. It pushes no real boundaries; that striking art style is merely a skin and the game does nothing creative with it. It’s offensive for the sake of being offensive, and, again, fails to use that offensive content to make a point. The game certainly makes no attempt to become metatextual and ask questions about game design or gameplay; it’s quite happy conforming to every genre convention there is. So, even though it executes the action quite smoothly, we’ve seen everything this game does better elsewhere, leaving the action to feel hollow and painfully like a grind over the longer term. Or to put it in simple terms; most people will go back to whatever shooter actually provides long term value once they're done messing around with this for a short period of time.

Because Drawn to Death appropriates a transgressive ethos without actually transgressing anything, it doesn’t take long for the game to feel more like the antithesis of the punk attitude it so badly wants us to buy into. In other words, it feels like a game made by a bunch of middle-aged men who prefer to talk about games as “content” rather than works of art, who are trying to manicure something that will be popular for a carefully researched target demographic, instead of making a game because they’ve got something to say, which is how actual transgressive artists think.

The context of Drawn to Death is that some incredibly bored teenager thinking up sadistic battle scenarios and doodling them into his notebook to while away a particularly dull class lesson. Perhaps this was Jaffe referencing his own childhood. If so, this game is perhaps the best reason to encourage children at school to pay attention to their teachers. If kids don't tune out and learn things, then a game like Drawn to Death may blessedly never happen again."

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Mr.SLaM on 04/15/17 at 03:24:50
So I've been super inactive lately because of college, but I almost had the chance to intern for Jaffe and work on this game. I didn't get past the second interview for whatever reason. You know what, I'm glad I didn't. This game took over 4 years to develop, and it is absolute trash. I have really lost respect for Jaffe as a game industry vet after this.

So my main complaints after a few games are as follows.

-The humor is awful, like I get being edgy and raunchy can be great, but this game is borderline autistic. It has Jaffe's fucking smug attitude all over it. He can be a really humble guy, but he was let off the chain with this, and it showed. I don't know what is worse, this game, or his super liberal rants on Twitter .

-The weapons and characters are unbalanced as all hell. Some weapons are just unusable, while others wipe the floor. The FU47 was a pea shooter, while the RPG is amazing.

-The levels are pathetically small, and the match sizes are a joke. Want to know why they made the game with smaller lobbies in mind? Because they knew the game would be dead in a month, it has nothing to do with homaging back to Unreal tournament or any other older arena shooters.

-The hold to skip is fucking infuriating. Jesus fuck, that frog can suck my balls. It never shut up.

-The notebook as a menu thing makes everything super tiny. I have a 42 inch tv, I shouldn't have to sit three feet away from it to see what the fuck I'm reading.

Now, there was some okay things about the game.

- I did enjoy the use of the Unity engine. They showed that you could make a professional looking game with it. The presentation is nice, besides the tiny menus and stupid main select screen that gives no hint as to what I'm selecting. Just give everything normal names for the love of god.

- The art is cool. I do like the art style. If everything wasn't so edgy, it would really be something to marvel at.

- I'm a sucker for a nice arena shooters, and as that one review said, the skeleton of one is here somewhere. It needs some refinement

- I like the character based fighting, and reminds a lot of Twisted Metal and Overwatch in a way, if they had an inbred child...

-The animations don't really bother me, as I think I play retro games too much. I'm in it for the gameplay. I really don't give a shit about detailed animations. This isn't Uncharted. People need to stop circle jerking graphics so much.

- It was free, and is another game my friends and I can play together. Although, they fucked that up too. I was playing an unranked with my friend, and we were wrecking the other team, and half way through the game it switches us to other teams. It did that like 3 times. That can't be a feature of the game, it has to be a fuck-up on their part. I hope to god it isn't a feature, because it makes the party system irrelevant. I'd also like to say that you can't do a public death-match with more than two people. Once again, that is retarded. What are we going to do, boost? Are the three of us going to gang up on the one random player in the lobby? That is just some bad game design right there. Drives me up the wall.

You know what guys? I'm glad Twisted Metal is dead. I don't want Jaffe putting his fingers on the franchise anymore. He has lost his touch, or maybe he never had it. I really think the people behind making TM1, 2, and Black so good were his team. Head-On proved we didn't need him, and while that game has its flaws, it is not a solid rendition. Hell, Small Brawl is my favorite, and Jaffe didn't even touch that game to my knowledge. Let's see Scott and some real fans of Twisted Metal get a chance at making a new AAA title for PS4. I would still love a TM1/2 Remaster. The modding thread is already at it!

I'm sure I'm leaving something out of this long winded rant, but that's my feeling this title.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by MoshfieldAsylum on 04/15/17 at 05:22:42

Mr.SLaM wrote on 04/15/17 at 03:24:50:
- It was free, and is another game my friends and I can play together. Although, they fucked that up too. I was playing an unranked with my friend, and we were wrecking the other team, and half way through the game it switches us to other teams. It did that like 3 times. That can't be a feature of the game, it has to be a fuck-up on their part. I hope to god it isn't a feature, because it makes the party system irrelevant. I'd also like to say that you can't do a public death-match with more than two people. Once again, that is retarded. What are we going to do, boost? Are the three of us going to gang up on the one random player in the lobby? That is just some bad game design right there. Drives me up the wall.

You know what guys? I'm glad Twisted Metal is dead. I don't want Jaffe putting his fingers on the franchise anymore. He has lost his touch, or maybe he never had it. I really think the people behind making TM1, 2, and Black so good were his team. Head-On proved we didn't need him, and while that game has its flaws, it is not a solid rendition. Hell, Small Brawl is my favorite, and Jaffe didn't even touch that game to my knowledge. Let's see Scott and some real fans of Twisted Metal get a chance at making a new AAA title for PS4. I would still love a TM1/2 Remaster. The modding thread is already at it!

I'm sure I'm leaving something out of this long winded rant, but that's my feeling this title.


Actually, yea lol, the drawn to death community would do that kind of thing. i didn't know about this new feature. seems like it's a necessary evil. boosting was an issue during the beta/limited access, and i saw hints of it in dtd's launch week. although i can't see why this feature would be in play for Unranked matches.
boosting was/probably still is a problem in Twisted Metal 2012.

I agree about your complains on DTD. The weapons are super imbalanced. There's no point in using the weaker weapons. Everyone goes for the weapons that get quick kills. Not sure why there are so many weapons in the game aside from them being greedy and thinking more content=more money. They could have just went with a dozen weapons and then balancing them would have been easier. It's something they couldn't figure out at all in the past few years.

I wouldn't want Jaffe to be involved in another Twisted Metal either. He doesn't listen to the fans, and doesn't take criticism well

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Archminion on 04/15/17 at 11:52:15
I agree,

Would love to see a new TM from the ESP guys.
I think it's definitely not unlikely since they have been away from it for a while and might be itching to get back in the saddle...

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Thumpy on 04/18/17 at 10:33:35
Don't forget the TMB designers who left Incognito for Disney.

They recently left Disney and are now working for another video game company, maybe they can breath some light into the TM franchise again.

E3 2017 is coming soon, I have been predicting a TM announcement for E3 2017.

Its just a hunch I've had for several years.

Mr. Slam, I can't believe we have been chatting on this site for 17 years now!


Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Varia31 on 04/19/17 at 23:24:50
For those who play this game, Jaffe shared this on Twitter recently.




Thumpy wrote on 04/18/17 at 10:33:35:
E3 2017 is coming soon, I have been predicting a TM announcement for E3 2017.

Man, I hope so!
And I'm not meaning to get too off topic here, but I have also been hoping for a sequel to PlayStation All-Stars Battle Royale. I personally had fun with it, and Sweet Tooth was my main in it.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by MoshfieldAsylum on 04/20/17 at 01:54:24

Varia31 wrote on 04/19/17 at 23:24:50:
For those who play this game, Jaffe shared this on Twitter recently.



Man, I hope so!
And I'm not meaning to get too off topic here, but I have also been hoping for a sequel to PlayStation All-Stars Battle Royale. I personally had fun with it, and Sweet Tooth was my main in it.


Yeah I knew a Twisted Metal skins pack was coming even without having to go on Jaffe's twitter. For one, the game launched with a God of War skins pack, and two, the game references TMX several times, and in the beta there was a SweetTooth-ish skin for Johnny Savage that was suddenly missing at game launch, so I knew it was coming. I also knew it would be limited to SweetTooth, Dollface, Mr. Grimm, & maybe Preacher and Calypso (unlikely). I fucking hate how Jaffe limited the TM cast down to a handful of schmucks. It showed in PS All Stars as well, because they could only use TMX characters. All those cool past characters have been forgotten.
I would like a sequel to Playstation All Stars Battle Royale myself but man, they have to get off TMX's universe. People loved TM for the classic games. if they make PSAS 2 they need to explore the classic TM universe. I'm sick of TMX characters. Why should I spend 10 dollars on skins for those watered down versions of TM characters? Screw that. Sorry I'm ranting, but it is so predictable of Jaffe. This skins pack dlc is no surprise at all. Shameless attempt at exploiting TM Fans for a buck with the hopes of tricking Sony into giving him another chance.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Varia31 on 04/20/17 at 08:00:42
@Mosh
To be fair, PS All-Stars used current incarnations for most, if not nearly all of the roster. Some of them were even based on upcoming games, like Raiden in his Metal Gear Rising body, which officially released the following year after All-Stars did. As for TMX, the game does still have a fan base, however small, and it is the most recent game, so it's logical that they would use the most familiar version to the (then current) public.

It would be nice to see more of the classic games represented too. I thought it was cool that Sweet Tooth had a tuxedo costume to resemble his more classic appearances. Even the freeze missile item you can pick up is clearly based on the TM1 version, being that it's a physical missile rather than a ball of ice energy when you pick it up. Some throwbacks to the classic games, even more recent ones like Head-On, might be nice to see.

Something good could come out of this though. However unlikely given the presumably small community of DtD, perhaps Sony can use customer purchases of the TM skin pack to gauge some degree of interest in a new TM...
Y'know, since fan demand doesn't seem to be enough for them. Haha

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by MoshfieldAsylum on 04/20/17 at 08:23:59

Varia31 wrote on 04/20/17 at 08:00:42:
@Mosh
To be fair, PS All-Stars used current incarnations for most, if not nearly all of the roster. Some of them were even based on upcoming games, like Raiden in his Metal Gear Rising body, which officially released the following year after All-Stars did. As for TMX, the game does still have a fan base, however small, and it is the most recent game, so it's logical that they would use the most familiar version to the (then current) public.

It would be nice to see more of the classic games represented too. I thought it was cool that Sweet Tooth had a tuxedo costume to resemble his more classic appearances. Even the freeze missile item you can pick up is clearly based on the TM1 version, being that it's a physical missile rather than a ball of ice energy when you pick it up. Some throwbacks to the classic games, even more recent ones like Head-On, might be nice to see.

Something good could come out of this though. However unlikely given the presumably small community of DtD, perhaps Sony can use customer purchases of the TM skin pack to gauge some degree of interest in a new TM...
Y'know, since fan demand doesn't seem to be enough for them. Haha


I realized that about PS All Stars but i found that kind of annoying about it. I was actually grateful for the TM3/tuxedo skin just because it's about the only TM on PS1 reference in the game. The freeze missile is a half-tribute to TM1, since it only looks a little bit like the missile from TM1, and the napalm ice cream & mines are things also TM1 related. There are also TMB trivia questions in the Buzz gameshow stage. I mean it's not "Playstation 3 All Stars" but that's what they basically went for aside from the characters that had no ps3 titles yet at the time. that aside i like the game just fine.

i disagree about TMX still having enough of a fan base to justify a skin pack based off those character versions though. if you go on TMX now you'll probably find an empty server lobby/browser. it has a very small fan base, sure, but i don't see the logic behind continuing to promote the tmx universe that no one aside a small number of people care for. the TM2 & TMB universes were far more popular and still hold interest well over a decade later than would be expected. TMX will be long forgotten in far less than a decade from now. i find it very arrogant of jaffe to do that (promote a failed game with skins for his new one), because it means he still wont accept TM 2012 was a failure. drawn to death shows he never learned from his mistakes then. it feels like tmx with less players, worse graphics, more of the same unbalanced gameplay, horrible matchmaking... a flawed spiritual successor to a flawed game. i know that's a bit savage for me to say, but it's not like i didn't give these titles a chance.

Title: Re: Drawn to Death Release date 4/4/17
Post by Thumpy on 04/22/17 at 02:22:57
Can you imagine if 'Drawn to Death' was nothing more than a deliberate joke.

Perhaps Jaffe was really working on a new 'Twisted Metal' all this time and used this 'Drawn to Death' as a distraction to keep everyone from thinking he was working on a new 'Twisted Metal' game.

Sounds sweet and its something I think he would do, he even flat out lied about the last Twisted Metal game and said he was not even working on it.

Also this 'Drawn to Death' might be an acknowledgment of the mistakes that were made with TMX, and that they won't be present in the next TM.

My thoughts are likely untrue but it would be so nice if it was.

"Come on Dave, tell us its true!"







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