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Message started by Chlamydia on 04/22/09 at 00:49:13

Title: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Chlamydia on 04/22/09 at 00:49:13
As an avid Twisted Metal fan myself I was wondering what do you think. Do smaller levels make for better gameplay because it's more confrontational? Or do bigger levels make for better gameplay because there's more to do and explore?
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Kilrgrn on 04/22/09 at 05:35:42
I myself prefer the small levels with little or no obstacles. Such as Dogpound(TMB), Holland(TM2), and Arena(TM1).


Also a big fan of multilevel battlegrounds such as LA roofs or NY Roofs. Although they're open they're more stratigical.

Levels like Paris piss me off. Too many Spectre players use that shit to their advantage and leave the big cars that I use like Hammerhead, in the dust. Not very fair IMO, but in team games it's that big of a deal.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Archminion on 04/22/09 at 06:56:17
I prefer the medium to bigger levels.

TM1 Cyburbia will always be one of the best levels in the series to me.
TM2 Hong Kong is another cool level I think which is pretty big but not to open.

I should have made it clear that I like bigger levels (with TM2 Paris being about the smallest) but I'm not into the wide open go anywhere levels like TM2 Holland or TMB Suburbs.

Throw in those rooftop levels to.

I'd like to add that in the future TM I think level size should dominate the player limit- so a small level like Suicide Slide holds only 8 players max.
While a big sprawling Cyburbia style map can hold 16.

I know there is worries about pick ups when there are to many players but surely they would be throwing in more pickups on a big map?

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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by RoaDiE on 04/22/09 at 11:17:51
No one played the biggest levels in TMBO because they were boring and too spread out, slowed the action down.

So no, bigger the level does not make better gameplay.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by magnum on 04/22/09 at 14:30:24
No. Not neccisarily.

The only times large levels were widely used whas when Unlims were popular. Other times, it was perfect running grounds for campers, and relic whores.

Big levels are ok for bot fighting in story mode. That's about it.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Vanilla Nikki on 04/22/09 at 15:05:45
It honestly depends on who I am competing against.  If I am playing against friends than I choose a smaller level ... all too often my friends get lost in the big levels and I have to teach them how to use their flippin radar.  Also with a smaller level it is extra difficult to collect weapons or you can grab all the goodies then leave your friend fucked LMFAO! But my favorite TM level is Cyburbia without a doubt. It was a large level but nicely sectioned so that you can build different strategies.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Archminion on 04/22/09 at 20:20:55
Jaffe was talking about flow in the levels, I get the impression he wants to see more levels like Cyburbia (for the biguns anyway).

As Vanilla Nikki says that level had lots of smaller sections within it. The canal was great! to get to it tho you had to enter one of the ramps.

Even tho its a big level I found it got you fighting- just stay away from that fuckin highway to infinity...
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by OutOfOrder on 04/23/09 at 04:02:51
"It honestly depends on who I am competing against. "

Agreed... when I played TMho alot I could beat the top tier players on the mini deathmatch levels simply because I had a tendency to value Aggression over Defense... they were all the other way around so it worked in my favor.  

I definitely prefer the small to medium sized levels for online play... in campaign I prefer the large ones. Multi tiered is good as well but can get old depending on the type of people your playing against... they're great with honorable players but their will always be campers I'm afraid... which as long as it's not a small game it really won't matter... Campers are rewarded with less deaths only... it never wins you a game unless it's LMS of course.

Regardless of our opinions on the topic I'm sure it will be open to everyone's preferences with a little bit of everything. I'm not concerned.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by PureNRG on 04/23/09 at 05:56:42
I guess it just depends on my mood.. whether I'm feelin like sniping or if I feel like going into a slugfest every 2 seconds. either way, my fave levels were TM1 Cyburbia, TMB Suburbs/Junkyard/Snowy Roads/Prison Passage/TM2 Antarctica/LA In Ruins
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by NightShade on 04/24/09 at 01:45:59
I'm always in favor of action packed levels, and those are usually smaller levels. I hate sniping and camping and driving really long distances with no combat.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by PureNRG on 04/24/09 at 05:39:38
whats the matter, Night? you dont like a nice, Sunday drive while destroying ppl?
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Roket on 04/24/09 at 06:02:41
smaller levels are better. I would of loved Big Suburbs etc better if we could fit like.. 16 people. They were great levels to play through the game but terrible online.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Pogo The Clown on 04/24/09 at 18:09:53
I'm a frequent user of all sized levels. Yet, it mainly depends on their aesthetics and obstacles, depth and interactivity if I'm to accrue disposition for them.

I think it depends and varies on narrowness and width, not to mention the convoluted details in larger levels such as buildings and sanctioned landscapes.

Considering massive battlegrounds, there are usually smaller regions you can resort to during combat.
In the larger levels, the only detriment is, is that there are many orifices to escape with, rendering the focal conflict partially elusive. Given that susceptibility, large levels tend to constitute the car chase scenario more often. This is merely what TM initially compelled towards capturing, respectively to it's predecessors.  

When it all comes down to it...

"It isn't the size that counts, it's the stability."
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by PureNRG on 04/25/09 at 06:08:20
holy shit, Pogo found his way to Temp TMA
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by XIZOR on 04/25/09 at 20:52:54
I like levels of all sizes but I think the larger levels are good because you can take a break from the action to go collect weapons before returning to the fight without being constantly harassed and forced to fight with only a couple of weapons.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by PureNRG on 04/26/09 at 01:41:32

XIZOR wrote on 04/25/09 at 20:52:54:
I like levels of all sizes but I think the larger levels are good because you can take a break from the action to go collect weapons before returning to the fight without being constantly harassed and forced to fight with only a couple of weapons.


very fucking true.. altho it sure makes your heart race when you're gettin chased and dont have anything on you

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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Pogo The Clown on 04/28/09 at 18:27:41
Oh, yes. I know that feeling! Using all tactics necessary to escape a fight gone awry, the rear view mirror is full of explosions! Ambushes are also horrible!
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by maartyrr on 05/01/09 at 15:12:45
i think it depends on the amount of cars in the game...a place like holland, snowy roads or the drive in is way to hectic for more than 4 cars and not enough weapons... which is why I usually use small levels (that don't have alot of obstacles) for 1v1 and medium to large levels for team matches...god, imagine the shit i would've gotten if my home turf was prison passage and not the drive in.

i think  these levels in the next TM should be more interactive than anything else, kinda like how everything blows up in v8arcade.  I would love to see that, but aside from blowing stuff up it should open up new areas to levels or damage your opponents (like the plane crash in tmb)
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by PureNRG on 05/02/09 at 04:40:01
the plane crash in Black can hurt someone if they're down there?? sweeeeeeet...

I havent had the chance to play V8 Arcade.. does it have the same stages as the original game?
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Pogo The Clown on 05/03/09 at 01:13:28
You know, maybe the "quantity" of items in a level doesn't solely contrive a faster more fluent artillery, it could also be the elapsed time before they're regenerated. Just a thought.

1V1 to 3 contestants in a medium level seem to have my utmost approval, if I were to dignify a particular liking. Obstacles however, I don't mind.
It propagates a colorful investment to the game, the convoluted exploration and space of the levels help interest, while simultaneously supporting creative thinking.

Smoothness is most important, clarity and fluidity. The levels, no matter how they're aligned, should always be pursued by one objective. The integrity and uniqueness of the game's title, and achieving that through the judgment of it's lucid structure, an equilibrium fit only for TM.  :)
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by DeathStrikesBack on 05/03/09 at 13:25:27
for those of us who don't want to read pogo's post via thesaurus here it is after being ran through babelfish into Japanese and then back.

'Perhaps " You have known; quantity" Level doesn' Item; In addition as for t they' Rather than being faster exclusively before, the fluent artillery, that it is possible to be elapsed time, you devise; It plays back re-. Exactly thought. If I should acquire dignity to the taste of specification, it seems that is my largest approval in 1V1 to 3 contestants of medium-sized level. But obstacle and I don' The heart of t. That the game of interest of help of level, while supporting creative thinking simultaneously to complicated investigation and the space, spreads colorful investment. Smoothness is most importance and clear pole calling coefficient of fluidity. Level, how they' Being arranged by the re-straight line, we should pursue always according to one purpose. game' Integrity and originality; Title and it' of s; Achieve that, with judgment; The transparent structure of s, the equilibrium which is agreeable just because of TM.'
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by XIZOR on 05/03/09 at 19:44:18
LOL!
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by ThumperMan3000 on 05/04/09 at 02:08:14
I like bigger levels since they allow more strategy.  Like in the Junkyard level of TM: Black, if you're playing as Spectre, and have some ammo on the Special Weapon to waste, you can fire off Ghost Missiles from far away.

It also allows benefit from exploration. A bigger level would often yield lots of hidden power-ups and possibly a secret unlockable or two.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Kilrgrn on 05/04/09 at 07:36:01
So..you can be a cheep-ass, alright I got it.

Moron
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by PureNRG on 05/05/09 at 09:59:29
haha, cheezin on the Ghost Missles.. a good way to get ppl pissed off at you. its all good tho, I cheeze homers from on top of the car crusher, but only in story mode tho. its a lil hard to piss off the AI
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by ThumperMan3000 on 05/06/09 at 03:08:23
Yeah. Sorry, didn't mean to anger people with that.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Pogo The Clown on 05/09/09 at 03:20:11
There should always be massive levels in TM IMO. I'd like to be able to embark on multiple plateaus. Like the New York roof tops adjoined to the suburbs and freeway, along with the far end being a junkyard or business district, or both, heck!

Enough with the levels being meticulously intricate, I'd like the vehicles to feel more life like, while still possessing the properties of the smooth flowing, heavy feel from black.

Yet, Black still felt like I was manipulating the mechanics of rc vehicles, bums me out!  I'm not too fond of the "toy car" feel myself.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by -SCoLD- on 05/09/09 at 05:57:59
I think TM should have small to massive levels.  Prison Passage is still the best level I've ever seen.  And every mini-level that was a part of it was great.  Small levels are amazing for online battles but the larger levels could fit maybe 24 cars.  I would think more than 24 would be chaotic and pickups would be scarce, but there could be some median in between.

I could go for really small levels also with only maybe 4 people, I mean SMALLER than they've ever made them.  If it had a cool theme, some moving parts, maybe an elevator or two, that small space gets doubled and a lot more interesting things could happen (although Spectre whoring would be possible too).

They are doing it justice though.  I trust them.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by PureNRG on 05/10/09 at 21:30:40
I would think that they could have a system built-in that could mediate setting based on the stage and how many ppl are playing.. like say you have a massive stage, like Prison Passage, and have 24 cars competing in it, wouldnt it be possibly to have a computer-controlled mediator that automatically sets (x) amount of pick-ups on the map, based on the number of ppl and what stage it is?

like Suicide Slide having 6 cars on it could yield (x) amount of pick-ups, but Suicide Slide with 4 cars could hold a smaller (x) amount of pick-ups
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Pogo The Clown on 05/12/09 at 19:21:02
That makes sense, not to mention the frequency of consumable pick-ups for the average player. This could constitute smoother game play. The intervals of regenerating items could also be considerable, for many of them vary from level to level.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by PureNRG on 05/13/09 at 04:03:41
that too.. I'd think they could mediate just about anything with the comp systems they run off of nowadays
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by imakillu... on 06/22/09 at 22:26:21
i think small levels make the best gameplay its more confrontational and exciting more action and everyone is always fair game
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by darth612 on 06/28/09 at 02:08:16
I like the freeway levels since you had to do u-turns alot.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Roket on 06/29/09 at 01:18:08
I enjoy smaller levels. Nothing as crazy linear as Snowy Roads and especially the Swamp level. More like Sewers, Movies, Asylum Halls, Holland, Moscow, Stadium (both TMHO and TMB). Hell even Snowy Roads was hella better than those large levels found in TMB and TMHO. Its great for single player but I've always been a fan of action.. not roaming around.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by PureNRG on 06/29/09 at 04:54:37
I fucking LOVE Snowy Roads.. one good power missle and it was over with :) and I had a good camping spot when I was playing against the AI
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by Pogo The Clown on 06/30/09 at 19:00:44
All those levels are great, there just needs to be incentive for larger levels though. People just prefer action over being in the reality of it all I guess. I think that there should be a level where you're aboard flying cargo planes, searing through the air from one open cavity to the next, falling and teleporting to new heights.
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by PureNRG on 07/01/09 at 05:10:46
a giant cargo plane would rock.. with the option to open and close the hatch
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by XIZOR on 07/05/09 at 18:45:58

The Dizaster Child wrote on 06/29/09 at 04:54:37:
I fucking LOVE Snowy Roads.. one good power missle and it was over with :) and I had a good camping spot when I was playing against the AI


FUCKING CAMPERZ!
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by PureNRG on 07/05/09 at 19:43:51
hey man, I said when I was playing against AI.. they dont get pissed LOL!! I dont camp or snipe in MP games tho. I usually get into head-on slugfests.. with weak cars and get my ass beat
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by ObsessedByCruelty on 07/18/09 at 05:11:54
I miss Snowy Roads...
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Title: Re: Do bigger levels make better gameplay?
Post by SweetToothsAssociate on 08/19/09 at 19:21:17

XIZOR wrote on 06/29/09 at 04:54:37:
FUCKING CAMPERZ!



Yeah Even in story your supposed to go in and fight not stay in the mountains like a wuss.
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